I think it is some sort of medieval torture device.
WHY for Pete's sake would you need this? A twisted wire crownpiece, a lariat noseband and a stud chain under the chin to complete the picture. That's great, just rip at their head from all directions. I can just picture this on some delicate little Arab's head. *shakes head and walks away*
Showing a horse in hand is something I never did in my show days - unless vet checks at events count - but I do believe there is a difference between a showmanship class and a halter class. Anyone out there know if that is the case? Either way, why for gawds sake would you need a device like this? Sad.
ReplyDeleteShowmanship is a class that shows cleanliness fitness and how responsive a horse is to its handler. Halter is based solely on a horses confirmation and movement. I don't see a problem using this device if it is used properly.
DeleteShowmanship is a class that shows cleanliness fitness and how responsive a horse is to its handler. Halter is based solely on a horses confirmation and movement. I don't see a problem using this device if it is used properly.
DeleteWhat I don't know about training and showing horses would fill quite a lot of books, but it seems to me that having one of these on a horse would be an automatic D/Q.
ReplyDeleteBut I suppose the sick f***s that use this kind of thing substitute a standard halter when it comes time to actually show.
Sadly, one my best friends uses this thing on her broke horse... Knowing her she doesn't get shank happy, but still...
ReplyDeleteGood lord... My Arab learned, as a relatively unhandled 3yo stallion, to mind his manners on a lead in a plain old padded nylon yearling halter. It took a whole hour. That was the first time I've ever taught a youngster lead line manners. What on earth could you possibly require this contraption for?!?!?!
ReplyDeletejeebus!!
ReplyDeleteThese are made for and marketed towards the stock horse breed circuit crowd, not arabs.
ReplyDeleteAnd Rod's has this thing back ordered, must be popular!
Maybe if showmanship horses were allowed act like they're actually alive people wouldn't be so hell bent on squashing any vital signs. Raise your head above your withers?!? Can't have that! *yank*
ARGH. This is just CRUEL!! You already have enough control with an Arab show halter - in fact those shanks can be a little nuts AS IS!!!!!
ReplyDeleteAs a former HS & Western Showmanship Queen, I believe that showmanship is about self-carriage, paying attention, and groundwork. REAL groundwork. It takes hours of patient and focused training, getting you and your horse used to each others' space. Like anything else with horses. But it's not very hard, just involved.
Heh.... I had a friend in 4H with the CUTEST li'l grey Arab, blinding white he was. She was a bratty but fun kid, and ALWAYS correct with the horses (her mom wouldn't tolerate otherwise)... she was in a saddleseat halter class, and old Count was being his usual perfect self, no fuss, no muss, set up perfectly and *looking* a bit fiery... which on his sweet face translated to "alert."
Well... the judge was done and had moved on, and the girl's mom yells from the rail "CUE HIM TO RELAX!!!!!!"
That just always struck me as funny.
Wait... it's for QUARTER HORSES???
ReplyDeleteUm... no.
nonononononononono.
HELLS TO THE NO.
If a 4H'er ever showed up to a meeting with one of those, she'd get an extensive re-education.
DigitSis - I believe the difference that the difference between Showmanship and Halter is the same as between Equitation and Pleasure classes. Showmanship judges the handler's competence and Halter judges the horse against breed standards.
ReplyDeletethis is marketed for for all breeds. its not for the people who want to train with hard work and time. its for the asses that don't work with their horses all winter and wanna go to a horse show the first week in May and expect to win. I have dumb asses at my barn like that! they use all sorts of cruel things to get the job done quick w/ out real training.
ReplyDeleteYa, know assuming some idiot doesnt misuse it... I dont see much wrong with it... In the right hands it can be safely used with mild discomfort to the horse.. I believe it is markets to stock horse breed.. No 4-hers should not be using it.. No anyone who isnt a 100% professional trainer should not be using this.. But a light handed experienced professional this may be exceptable as a piece of training equipment
ReplyDelete"mild discomfort to the horse"
ReplyDeleteNo.
If, after hours and weeks of attempts with a halter or snaffle bit, your horse simply will NOT relax & pay attention, then you're
a) not doing it right
b) dealing with a very freaked out and high-strung horse
(please refer to option a)
I mean, showmanship is NOT rocket science! It just takes time. Heck, 20 dedicated minutes a day for a month (with a helper, some cones, and experienced observers occasionally) will get you up to speed for a lot of open shows.....
(I've done it myself with a reasonably well-behaved horse. Some days you work on pivots, some days you work on your 3-second setup, every day you work on trotting straight lines.... geting your hands in the "cookie tray" position.... elbows in.... snappy foot moves... etc. It didn't take all that long before she was pivoting, stopping, going... with NO contact.)
ReplyDelete(Even the crazy pony got it.)
ouch ouch ouch...
ReplyDeletePoor Pony.
I've seen something like this before. One lady I worked for had something like this to use on a mare when she got her shots instead of lip-chaining her because the horse would freak out for shots or something like that.
ReplyDeleteThats horrible that people actually use this for training though!
Jo-
ReplyDelete>>No anyone who isnt a 100% professional trainer should not be using this.. <<
Sorry, but if you are a professionall trainer, you wouldn't need to resort to a POS like this to get results. Not if you had any TSK that is...
Or a POS like this to get the job done. (and we all know we have beat this one to death enough on FHOTD...)
If either is needed, you ain't a trainer!
I feel for the horses in your barn...
And the one in the link- is marketed towards Arab folks. Arab, NSH, ASB and also some stock breeds as they try to supply everyone equally...
ReplyDeleteWTF CNJ!?!?!?! They market it for training WEANLINGS?!?!?!?!?!!?!??!
ReplyDeleteGood Gravy Marie. I guess the only horse it would be good for would be... a fiberglass one. I can see the merit in an old-fashioned soft rope be-nice halter if you've got a serious puller who's simply a bad actor (and not hurt or scared, just a shithead who's caused folks some injury or something)
but.. that chain thing?
UGH.
Surely you are joking. This contraption looks like two leather curb straps had a run in with high tensile fencing in the pasture. I agree with CNJ; if you are a professional, you shouldn't need a device like this to show an Arab. Having little experience in the Arab world, I know that they are a lively breed but seem intelligent and rather dainty- surely there is another way to get the desired look without abusing the horse's nose, poll, and other pressure points to do it.
ReplyDeleteCP- Yep! Weanies and Yearlings. Nothing is exempt from the beating of a lifetime in the Arab halter horse world. If you aren't inflicting pain from all angles on the head, you beat the snot out of the rest of the body with the whip.
ReplyDeleteBefore the classes, the horses will come to the paddock area with a cooler or blanket on so they can whip and whack away without leaving a welt which would get them DQ'ed in a flash. Also the reason they go after the lower legs. Not much soft tissue to raise a welt when whipped, just be sure to wipe off any dust marks before entering the ring. IF you can get near their legs after that.
Once they move up to performance classes, the abusive measures are still there, the assholes just change the type of equipment...
***NOTE- NOT ALL Arab people or trainers are like this, but plenty of us in the industry know Exactly WHO ARE!***
Just another fine example of abusive shit people will do IN PUBLIC! No telling what further measures they employ at home...
Ive used this for a long time with many of my horses and yes it can harm them if missused or if u pull too hard when they rare up but it is a TRAINING DEVICE sometimes horses get hurt in training its nothing new it is not animal abuse its training
ReplyDeleteI show stock type and came across this halter at a QH show in May this year. Now, I am all for being nice to my horse, but I did buy this halter and it has been a contributing factor in going from good to WOW. Yes, anything can be abusive the hands of the wrong people. This is definitely one of those objects. However, my horse can do ALL showmanship maneuvers without a halter quite nicely. This was just a training tool that has helped put the finishing touch. I went from not placing at QH shows to being undefeated in novice youth for the rest of the year, and I am attributing it to this halter. When we bought the halter, the lady was quite willing to tell us that you should never jerk on the horse with this on.
ReplyDeleteI just bought one. It could very very VERY easily do a lot of harm if not in the proper hands. It's a tool for horses that need to learn to be much faster in their response from their handler. Not every horse needs it and I certainly wouldn't use it on a youngster. I have it for one who has to learn to be more responsive to his ques. Some horses get it really quick and some others need more refinement. I would compare it to using Spurs or not using Spurs. It's certainly not meant to be used as a crutch during training. It's a short lived tool.
ReplyDeleteI just bought one. It could very very VERY easily do a lot of harm if not in the proper hands. It's a tool for horses that need to learn to be much faster in their response from their handler. Not every horse needs it and I certainly wouldn't use it on a youngster. I have it for one who has to learn to be more responsive to his ques. Some horses get it really quick and some others need more refinement. I would compare it to using Spurs or not using Spurs. It's certainly not meant to be used as a crutch during training. It's a short lived tool.
ReplyDelete